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Post by El Caracho on Dec 19, 2017 15:58:59 GMT
From the Cobi facebook page in the comments section of the 2513 Sturmtiger box picture:
December 13th 10:03
Darek M.: When will you release a 4 engine B 17 [Flying Fortress]?
(siakowski A kiedy 4 silnikowy B 17)
December 13th 11:37
Cobi: Currently there are no plans to release this
(Na razie nie mamy go w planach)
That is very unfortunate :-(
I got all the Cobi bombers immediately when they were released as WW2 Airplane Collection magazine issues,
so when I received them all a 2nd time as boxed sets, I thought of opening them all on a big pile of bricks and start building a B-17.
But then I realised that it was not possible, because none of the existing bombers does contain a cockpit part that would fit to a B-17:
Existing Cobi bombers:
5532 "PZL P-37B Los" -> Cockpit parts only 4 studs wide, unusable for big bombers
5534 "Heinkel He 111 P-4" -> parts not usable for any other bomber
5530/5541 "North American B-25 Mitchell" -> Trans clear window part behind the nose piece should be in a non-transparent color to be usable for other planes
5531 "Vickers Wellington MK. 1C" -> Very special nose piece, not even usable for Avro Lancaster, B-24J or Halifax MK.I
5533 "Nakajima Ki-49 (Helen)" -> The only plane where the window part behind the nose piece is in a non-transparent color
4-engined bombers taken into consideration:
B-17 Flying Fortress: Not possible with currently existing cockpit parts
B-24 Liberator: B-24D with upside down B-25 nose & Ki-49 brown "window" part, B-24J maybe with Vickers Wellington nose piece
B-29 Superfortress: B-25 nose piece (not really the correct shape) + use the rounded bottom piece also upside down for the top, so no upper cockpit windows at all
Avro Lancaster: Maybe with Vickers Wellington nose piece?
Handley Page Halifax: MK.I maybe with Vickers Wellington nose piece, MK.III with B-25 nose & Ki-49 brown "window" part
Short Stirling: Not possible with currently existing cockpit parts
Any thoughts?
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 19, 2017 15:59:24 GMT
You need to consider a little detail, a 4-engine bomber in minifig scale will be too much big like a children toy and heavy about weight too. Some of the 4 engine bombers are just slightly larger than the Vickers Wellington, so it might still work |
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 19, 2017 16:00:01 GMT
I have calculated the potential lenght and wingspan of 4 engine bombers in Cobi scale: | Bomber | Lenght in m
| Wingspan in m
| Lenght/Width Ratio
| Cobi Lenght in cm
| Cobi Wingspan in cm
| Cobi Lenght/Width Ratio
| Scale Lenght
| Scale Wingspan
| | PZL P-37B Łoś | 12,92
| 17,93
| 1:1,39
| 33,0
| 43,5
| 1:1,32
| 1m = 2,55 cm
| 1m = 2,43 cm
| | B-25 Mitchell | 16,13 | 20,60
| 1:1,28
| 42,5
| 48,5
| 1:1,14
| 1m = 2,63 cm
| 1m = 2,35 cm
| | Heinkel He 111 | 16,40 | 22,60
| 1:1,38
| 41,0
| 51,0
| 1:1,24
| 1m = 2,50 cm
| 1m = 2,26 cm
| | Nakajima Ki-49 | 16,50 | 20,42
| 1:1,24
| 40,5
| 51,0
| 1:1,26
| 1m = 2,45 cm
| 1m = 2,50 cm
| | Vickers Wellington | 19,69 | 26,27
| 1:1,33
| 47,0
| 54,0
| 1:1,15
| 1m = 2,39 cm
| 1m = 2,06 cm
| | B-24 Liberator | 20,60 | 33,50
| 1:1,63
| 51,7
| 77,7
| 1:1,50
| 1m = 2,51 cm
| 1m = 2,32 cm
| | Avro Lancaster | 21,11 | 31,09
| 1:1,47
| 53,0
| 72,1
| 1:1,36
| 1m = 2,51 cm
| 1m = 2,32 cm
| Handley Page Halifax
| 21,82 | 31,75
| 1:1,46
| 54,8
| 73,7
| 1:1,34
| 1m = 2,51 cm
| 1m = 2,32 cm
| | B-17 Flying Fortress | 22,66 | 31,62
| 1:1,40
| 56,9
| 73,4
| 1:1,29
| 1m = 2,51 cm
| 1m = 2,32 cm
| | Short Stirling | 26,60 | 30,20
| 1:1,14
| 66,8
| 70,1
| 1:1,05
| 1m = 2,51 cm
| 1m = 2,32 cm
| | B-29 Superfortress | 30,18 | 43,06
| 1:1,43
| 75,8
| 99,9
| 1:1,32
| 1m = 2,51 cm
| 1m = 2,32 cm
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For the calculated lenght and wingspan values for the 4 engine Cobi bombers I used the average scale factor of the 5 existing bombers, which was: 1m = 2,51 cm for the lenght 1m = 2,32 cm for the wingspan Apparently the Nakajima Ki-49 ist the most accurate Cobi model judging from the lenght/width ration, which is 1:1,24 for the real plane and 1:1,26 for the Cobi model |
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Post by achtungpanzer on Dec 19, 2017 22:15:42 GMT
Well, by comparing real pics of a B17 flying fortress the nose section can be done with the excisting cobi bricks, only the color would be non matching
That cobi B25 glass nose section is perfect for a B17 (it has the right shape) accept for the transparant section what lies beneath it ( shape is also good accept for the transparency)
Same part as the brown section on the Nakajima, but again that is the wrong color (brown)
The only option is to spray paint that section in matching green (incalcatore knows the matching color) or to use maybe some sloped bricks instead
So i don't think that's a real problem, but the extended part of the tail what runs over the top of the fuselage will be a real challenge to duplicate
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Post by Sepp Dietrich on Dec 20, 2017 0:56:29 GMT
From the Cobi facebook page in the comments section of the 2513 Sturmtiger box picture: December 13th 10:03 Darek M.: When will you release a 4 engine B 17 [Flying Fortress]? (siakowski A kiedy 4 silnikowy B 17) December 13th 11:37 Cobi: Currently there are no plans to release this (Na razie nie mamy go w planach) That is very unfortunate :-( Hi Caracho. I would wait till the end of January/beginning of February when the toy fair in Nürnberg is over.So maybe i will get information from the owner of Super-Bricks what new items are planed for 2018. |
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 20, 2017 9:41:56 GMT
PZL P-37B Łoś North American B-25B Mitchell Heinkel He 111 P-4 Nakajima Ki-49 'Helen' Vickers Wellington Mk.1C 
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 20, 2017 9:44:38 GMT
PZL P-37B Łoś North American B-25B Mitchell Heinkel He 111 P-4
Nakajima Ki-49 'Helen' Vickers Wellington Mk.1C
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 20, 2017 10:49:09 GMT
Well, by comparing real pics of a B17 flying fortress the nose section can be done with the excisting cobi bricks, only the color would be non matching That cobi B25 glass nose section is perfect for a B17 (it has the right shape) accept for the transparant section what lies beneath it ( shape is also good accept for the transparency) Same part as the brown section on the Nakajima, but again that is the wrong color (brown) The only option is to spray paint that section in matching green (incalcatore knows the matching color) or to use maybe some sloped bricks instead So i don't think that's a real problem, but the extended part of the tail what runs over the top of the fuselage will be a real challenge to duplicate Yeah, I know, the glass nose from the B-25 would be suitable, plus the non-tranparent nose piece from the Nakajima Ki-49, but then the problem starts: The upper cockpit windows of the B-17 are kind of "on top" of the overall circular cross-section of the hull, like Cobi did do it on the PZL P-37B Łoś. But unfortunately you cannot use the PZL P-37B Łoś cockpit parts, because the hull of that plane is only 4 studs wide and the upper cockpit only fits one crew member. But if you use the upper cockpit window of the B-25, Nakajima Ki-49 or Vickers Wellington, you get a circular cross-section including the upper cockpit part, but that does not correspond with the shape of a B-17.  |
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Post by achtungpanzer on Dec 20, 2017 21:54:46 GMT
I get what you mean about that upper cockpit, the LOS is perfect for that matter shape wise Here a comparison of a real B17 and the LOS;   The cockpit on the real B17 is smaller than the width of the fuselage, so that 4 stud width is perfect i think (even if you can place only 1 pilot in it) Now here comes the problem; making that LOS cockpit on your b25..... At the look of it, my guess is that you have to "customize" that cockpit holder brick what is below it (that means sawing...) so that you can attach it on your wider b25, and fill up the gap with rounded sloped bricks if possible I don't own cobi bombers, so i can't judge hoe those big sized one piece bricks are.... What i do now is that i am not particular fond of those large one piece bricks that's for sure Maybe you can make that frontal hull in bricks? And use the LOS cockpit in combination? Here is a solution in bricks for the tail, the cobi Hercules;  It has about the same long shape as a b17 tail, only adjust the shape in bricks on top |
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Post by achtungpanzer on Dec 20, 2017 22:16:13 GMT
So, now the frontal glass/ takajima brown brick ( i would definately spray it green) and the tail is solved, here's the biggest problem;   Attaching that small Los cockpit on the wider b25.... Well,somehow there is got to be a way i'm sure (Assuming you want that smaller Los cockpit...) I think the cobi b25 cockpit is definitly to wide in comparison, so the only option is a 4 stud width cockpit if you want that cockpit to be smaller than the b25 width |
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Post by achtungpanzer on Dec 21, 2017 7:06:18 GMT
Hmmm... after close examination on my computer (instead of my cellphone), i can now see that the LOS cockpit itself is not 4 studs wide but actually 3 studs (and maybe little)
That cockpit brick holder is 4 studs wide....
Indeed a little bit narrow in comparison
If it was actually 4 studs, that would be just enough (looking at cars with 2 seats for 2 minifigs is also 4 studs wide but i know, a bit to narrow for the arms)
But still, i think it wouldn't look that bad to use it
If you can place only 2 minifig heads between that window on a brickplate, i would definitly use it!
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 21, 2017 17:35:28 GMT
Here is a solution in bricks for the tail, the cobi Hercules; Thanks for all the advice. The "Hercules" solution for the tail sounds like a good idea. I was thinking of using several of the 2x6 wing flaps with hinges at one side in a upright position for that but I wasn't sure how to mount them exactly centered ... I assembled the PZL P-37B Łoś last night and noticed that the cockpit parts have an uneven width, something between 4 and 5 studs ... strange. But the PZL P-37B Łoś cockpit window is definitely too narrow for a B-17. And I also couldn't find any usable parts in the upcoming releases "Messerschmitt BF 110", "Lockheed P-38 Lightning" and "De Havilland Mosquito" But I noticed that the "saw" is apparently an official tool at Cobi too, if you look closely at these prototype pictures:  Also notice the different engine noses on each side of the P-38 Lightning! |
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Post by achtungpanzer on Dec 21, 2017 22:02:25 GMT
Too bad you can't use that pzl los cockpitwindow.... Maybe an option is to look at some lego b17 mocs on the internet and see how they pull it off with plain bricks
I already "saw" (;-)) that p38 had 2 different engine noses a while back, like cobi still isn't sure which side they will use on their production model
I think that flat rear tail part on the me110 and the lightning are brick-like parts, as it looks like one is made out of 2 parts and the othe out of 3 parts, instead of that it is cut/sawed
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Post by achtungpanzer on Dec 21, 2017 22:23:20 GMT
Hey, you're right!!!
They sawed it of indeed, as the raw edges are clearly visible...
So that's what it is, hmmmm..... Not a real good job if you tell me ;-(
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Post by El Caracho on Dec 22, 2017 12:41:27 GMT
I already "saw" (;-)) that p38 had 2 different engine noses a while back, like cobi still isn't sure which side they will use on their production model Well, now we know:  |
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